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Historical Hobble Skirts
by
Art Foster
Posted
: 2006-01-18 22:05
Last Update
: 2006-02-05 21:42
Back in Oct I promised I'd submit some actual New York Times articles on hobble skirts that I'd copied from microfilm some years back. I did a fairly extensive search on the period of 1911 through 1914. The result was a surprisingly amusing series of short articles of human interest that showed up in various sections of the paper. I'll start typing them in as able. I think you'll find the content is enhanced by that era's use of language. Most of these articles come from 1911 when hobble skirts made their appearance and were a novelty. In fact, in some places they became an uproar, though not perhaps as much as "harem skirts" or "harem trousers", which were really outragious and indecent.
Further, I copied a number of pictures (mostly drawings in those days) that went along with the Sunday fashion sections. Interestingly, although hobble skirts continued to appear, the "hobble" description was largely dropped after 1911 or 12, and instead they were referred to simply as narrow styles or tight skirts or some such. Women were after that look of flourishing up top while slinking narrowly down to the feet, and among the fashionable, this was the sought-after asthetic of the day.
Here's the first article:
HOBBLE RIOT IN NINTH AVE.
Two Girls Who Ventured There Forced to Call on Police for Help.
The hobble skirt is still a curiostiy on upper Ninth Avenue. Two young women so attired appeared there yesterday afternoon and small boys at once set up a cry of "Hobble, hobble." In a few minutes a crowd of boys and young men collected and laughed and jeered at them.
Thoroughly frightened the girls sought the West Forty-seventh Street Police Station. The journey from Ninth Avenue to the station house was one of agony for them, since to run was impossible, and the crowd pressed close.
Lieut. Rheimich, who was on desk duty, summoned the reserves, and six patrolmen went into the street and tried to drive away the crowd, but the street kept filling up.
After a long wait the two girls started home, escorted by Detective Noonan and Patrolman Pritchard. After a few steps, however, the girls begged to be taken back, the jeers and cheers proving too much for them.
A little later, with a still stronger guard of police, who formed a cordon around the two young women, the journey home was made.
by
Art Foster
Posted
: 2006-01-20 16:44
Ok, here's another article from the New York Times, circa 1911 (all words exact):
HOBBLE "BATHING" SKIRTS.
The Wearer of One Is Just Able to Trip to the Water's Edge
By Marconi Transatlantic Wireless Telegraph to The New York Times.
PARIS, July 24, (by telegraph to Clifden, Ireland; thence by wireless.)- The fashion of the "hobble skirt" has extended to bathing dresses.
Those Parisiennes who go to seaside resorts rather for the purpose of exhibiting their beauty than for sea bathing, always pay particular attention to this feature of their toilets, and every Summer sees some new departure in the matter of bathing dress. Occasionally the shortness of the skirt has been a feature. This Summer the new skirt is longer, but much tighter, and follows the prevailing style in the way in which it is drawn in below the knees.
Judging by the examples seen at Parisian establishments, the leg action necessary in swimming is absolutely out of the question for any woman wearing the new style of bathing dress. In it she would just be able to trip to the water's edge.
(That's all there was, and no pictures. If anyone has more info on hobble bathing dresses, please submit. Amazing, huh? More articles to follow...)
Re: Historical Hobble Skirts
by
Art Foster
Posted
: 2006-02-05 20:02
Here's another couple of articles. Enjoy!
“HOBBLES” AND DANCING
Women’s New Fashions Will Influence Length of Steps.
LONDON, Nov. 3.-Dancing authorities here have predicted a great change in the dancing of this season. Not only have the moving times much to do with the changes, but the fashions also will, to a great extent, taboo certain dances, including those so popular with the late King Edward, who delighted to watch the “pushing” along in deux-temps.
The Georgian dances of the eighties are now being substituted for the Edwardian figures. The general effect of the waltz will be calm and slow, to admit of the smaller steps of the ladies, necessitated by the narrower skirts in fashion. Still, although square dances are becoming rapidly more and more unpopular, there is still to be seen the lancers at some of the select private dances. In this dance, according to certain debutantes, during the third set comes the “flights,” and the “old genteel twiddles” have been literally “set to corners.”
One of the still popular dances is the waltz introduced by “The Merry Widow.” The dancers break off in the waltz and take hands, only to go yet apart again, and do pretty little steps on your own in a corner, or maybe not in a corner. Certain gliding dances are also coming into favor, but very slowly. It is expected, however, that the modern ways of dancing the dances of the eighties will be in full swing by the time the Coronation season will have arrived. Among the revivals will be The old English Morris dances and singing games, together with the musical quadrilles.
BOYS JEER HOBBLED SKATERS
They Have Small Respect for the Latest Modes on Central Park Lake.
A few martyrs to the hobble skirt came in for a hazing yesterday on the frozen surface of the Central Park lake at 110th Street. As soon as any girl with her skirts clinging modishly to her ankles took her stand upon the ice her perils of an early and resounding tumble were increased by the small boys, who formed a hooting ring around her to see the fun.
“Let it skate,” one rude boy yelled as each shackled skater made her appearance, and the crowd stopped to see if she really dared.
Uproarious laughter greeted the unappy outcome as soon as the girl attempted the broad, old-time stride, and down the rescuing police had to swoop.
The escorts of the hobble skirted had no easy task. They had to be props and tugs at once. The girl’s mind would be wholly occupied with the problem of remaining upright, and if she kept her skates parallel and horizontal with the ice, it was all that any one could ask. Her companion looked only too thankful if he managed to get her back to shore without a mishap.
Re: Historical Hobble Skirts
by
Art Foster
Posted
: 2006-02-05 21:42
Another yet - note the practicality of a tight skirt!
TIGHT SKIRTS CAUSE PARIS FASHION WAR
Many Leading Costumers Denounce Them as Robbing Woman of Her Grace.
DEFENDERS SCORE A POINT
Prevailing Style Proves Popular During the Rainy Days at the Race Track.
Special Cable to THE NEW YORK TIMES.
PARIS, June 25.-There is a battle royal in progress in Paris this week, with women’s skirts as the issue. Are these indispensable portions of feminine raiment to remain tight-possibly, even be made tighter-or are they to be cut with an aesthetic width? That is the question which has arrayed the leading dressmakers of the city in two hostile camps.
The revolution against the prevailing style is headed by a “couturier” whose name is familiar to two continents.
“I have never debased my artistic sense,” he told THE NEW YORK TIMES correspondant, “by making a single one of the costumes which have condemned women to the most ungraceful movement. It is possible to imagine her making. See how she hobbles! Look at her mincing steps! Where is the grace which should characterize her movements? Where is the majestic mien that has made poets liken her unto a goddess? Where is that swish of her garments, that charming ‘frou-frou,’ which marked her progress heretofore?”
This dressmaker is not alone in the fight. Others of his trade are banded with him, but on the opposing side are certain firms of great authority.
The battle really began last Sunday, when the innovators sent out to Auteuil a strong force of models whose skirts were a distinct departure from the prevailing mode. Wednesday witnessed another engagement, which seemed to end in favor of the tight skirtists, for the weather was entirely on their side. Rain fell heavily at frequent intervals, and, as the tight skirts were necessarily cut shorter than the other variety, they won many feminine votes on the ground of convenience.
Yesterday was expected to be a decisive day, for the Prix des Drags usually brings forth the last word in the new season’s styles, but again the weather caused a postponement of the final engagement, and so the issue will tremble in the balance till to-morrow, when society will see the Grand Prix race.
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Weaing Hobble Skirts in Public
by
Jayne
Posted
: 2006-01-16 07:24
Last Update
: 2006-02-02 03:19
My husband likes me to wear an ankle length hobble skirt when we go out to a restaurant or the theatre sometimes. It's black leather, very tight of course and I usually wear boots underneath. It takes me ages to go any distance of course, but he loves to see me take very small steps in my heels. Going upstairs is most difficult, of course, as the leather is so very tight, but he really enjoys it, and so do I, to be honest.
Do any other ladies wear hobble skirts when going out?
Re: Weaing Hobble Skirts in Public
by
si
Posted
: 2006-02-02 03:19
my wife wears a very tight black satin hobble skirt sometimes, she says she enjoys it and I love t see her struggle to walk in it!!! Sge won't go out in it as it is just not practical, but we do have fun at home!!
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Woohoo!!! Jayne Mansfield!!!
by
Jahoo
Posted
: 2006-01-15 02:33
Last Update
: 2006-01-15 02:33
Wow! I forgot about Jayne Mansfield!!! She looks amazing. Too bad she never was around to wear a latex hobbleskirt...
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Maike question
by
Rubber lover
Posted
: 2006-01-07 00:01
Last Update
: 2006-01-07 00:01
I just saw pictures of Maike in the gallery. Where did that dress come from? It would certainly be a challenge to wear (maybe put on) and it would make a lovely addition to my collection. I'd like to know where I can get one.
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Mariah Carey (Again)
by
Miss Sandra
Posted
: 2005-12-17 16:22
Last Update
: 2005-12-17 16:22
I have been viewing the gallery, which gets more and more interesting and was wondering if anyone could tell me when and where the concert was in which Mariah is wearing the gold dress (the first one in the series of pictures) and also that stunning pink dress. I do hope someone can help and I would thank them for their time and trouble.
Hey, Have Fun
Miss Sandra
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sweaterdresses
by
sweatersau
Posted
: 2005-12-14 00:58
Last Update
: 2005-12-17 19:22
Anyone into long tight sweaterdresses? My favourite fetish would have to be a turtleneck sweaterdress, ankle length and very tight, matched with high heel lace-up boots and a knee length tight cardigan, buttoned all the way to the bottom. Made from angora or mohair preferably. On a warm day, oh what a punishment!
Re: sweaterdresses
by
Maurice
Posted
: 2005-12-17 19:22
On the subject of sweater dresses, I recall that my sister used to wear one a few years ago. Not particularly long - just below knee length - but a reasonably tight fit and at first glance seemingly stretchy. But this to some degree was an illusion as the skirt part was lined with a strong, straight, rigid nylon lining. This was apparently to preserve the shape of the dress and not allow the skirt hem to become stretched out of shape over time through walking. Thus the lining was carefully cut to allow steps to the natural extent of the skirt hem, but no further. At first appearance a very soft, luxurious sweater dress but concealing what amounted to little more than a non-stretch hobble skirt beneath it.
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Scene in movie
by
Jayne
Posted
: 2005-11-28 00:30
Last Update
: 2005-11-28 23:10
Saw a scene in a Lizzie Maguire movie my friend's daughter was watching. Hillary Duff wearing all kinds of hobbleskirts. It was a movie where Lizzie Maguire goes to Rome.
Re: Scene in movie
by
art foster
Posted
: 2005-11-28 21:18
I take it you don't know the name of the movie? If anyone does, I would like to know.
Another movie worth checking, I think made-for-TV, unfortunately, but one that might show up again: Cinderella, starring Brandy as Cinderella and Bernadette Peters as the wicked stepmother. Peters goes about town in a very definite hobble skirt.
Re: Scene in movie
by
Admin
Posted
: 2005-11-28 23:10
The official title is The Lizzie McGuire Movie - now listed in our Video section - and there is a still in the Gallery as well.
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Morticia
by
Kat
Posted
: 2005-10-31 20:50
Last Update
: 2005-11-04 14:00
Happy Halloween!!!! Don't forget to think of Morticia Addams my hero!!!! She's the ultimate hobbleskirt queen in my book!!!!
Re: Morticia
by
Art Foster
Posted
: 2005-10-31 23:48
Morticia was the best! I keep my eyes open for a DVD collection of the TV series - why they did Munsters first I don't know.
Even her nightgowns were hobble dresses. It must've been a lot of work for Carolyn Jones to wear those dresses all the time. I've never seen her make any personal comment on it, has anyone? And whose idea was it to make such a tight skirt when the original Addams comic had a skirt more clinging but wide? It's hard to get answers now.
Re: Morticia
by
Kat
Posted
: 2005-11-01 12:21
Well, I saw somewhere in my exhaustive searches of the net and my collection of period magazines that she actually liked the dresses. She remarked one time that she wore them out once in awhile to costume parties because that's what the people wanted her to come as. Once you got used to them they weren't bad, she said. Of course, the dresses were tight, but she told them her measurements were something like 35-27-36 when they were something like 36-27-37. The cartoon is hard for me to tell how tight the dresses are.
Re: Morticia
by
Miss Sandra
Posted
: 2005-11-01 15:40
Fist of all can I say just how wonderful you look in that hobble skirt in the gallery. I believe you could give Morticia a run for her money over the tightness of the skirt.
However, I have tried very unsuccesfully to find some nice pictures of of Morticia on the net and I wondered if you could recommend any good sites.
Hey - have fun
Miss Sandra
Re: Morticia
by
Kat
Posted
: 2005-11-02 00:42
Well, there aren't many sites about the Addams Family. Go to Addamsfamily.com I think is the one with the best links and images. Or google Mortica Addams in the images search. Not much out there. My boyfriend has many stills of her but he can't get to them right now as he's moving. Oh how I love how morticia wiggles when she walks, and even does the twist in her dress...
Re: Morticia
by
Art Foster
Posted
: 2005-11-04 02:31
Morticia does everything in her dress as though it were normal and this is how women should dress, in fact putting a cousin into one in one episode, as well as her daughter. She is supremely confident - her confinement only adds to her sensual elegance. And she engages in sports wearing it - badminton, fencing, etc., although she does everything standing in one spot, using expertise while Gomez dances about her with a silly excess of motion. And when she is in a hurry - well, that is great fun to watch as well. If anyone sees these episodes for sale, holler!
Re: Morticia
by
karl101
Posted
: 2005-11-04 14:00
The Addams Family: Season 1
But not in stock at the moment.
http://www.play.com/play247.asp?pa=srmr&page=title&r=R2&title=702362
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sightings
by
art foster
Posted
: 2005-10-26 16:32
Last Update
: 2005-12-09 05:14
Not too long ago I was in France, and passing through an open air market was a young woman in a tight denim mermaid skirt; the tightest I've ever seen. She was very pretty, and her shapely figure was brought out by the skirt (actually it was a dress - she had on a jacket) which clung to her legs past her knees, then flared to her ankles, covered in high heeled boots. Her walk was a wonder to watch, with a subtle sway as her knees and thighs strained at the tight fabric. She was with a boyfriend and her family, I believe. Later, I saw her standing outside a shop, hand on a hip, with a knee pushed out against the boundaries of the skirt, which were minimal indeed. A great travel memory.
My girlfriend also describes that when she was younger and in Japan, she had a chance to wear a Kimono. She says that the way they are wrapped, there's not much room for the legs (especially if skinny like her) and they simply don't come unwrapped while moving - Japan is essentially a country with a tradition of hobble skirts. And with potential pitfalls: when her friend was winding her obie (long sash that winds many times around the waist over the kimono and ties in back), she accidently bound my friend's trailing sleeves into it. There was no getting the arms free, either: the sleeves are used like pockets, and my friend had objects in them such as a camera that would not pull through. She had to untie her and start over.
On the note of sleeves (not skirt discussion, but like heels, a great adjunct) I once saw a woman at a medieval fair dressed in a busty lace-up dress with off-the-shoulder sleeves that were very tight on the upper arms - so much so she had to lean back and struggle to reach the shoulder height counter. The whole outfit was very becoming, and I doubt she could have unlaced herself. The question is, have any of the women corresponding here worn off-shoulder sleeves they felt confined their arms? How about other confining sleeves? Have you combined them with hobble skirts?
I would like to express my gratitude to all women who have traded comfort and freedom for fashion. You are all wonderful.
Re: sightings
by
Rebbel49
Posted
: 2005-10-29 14:02
Art’s note on sleeves raises some interesting thoughts! I have always assumed that off-shoulder sleeves offer no real restriction, as lifting your arm would simply pop the neckline up onto the shoulder. I guess something tightly laced would be more difficult but, costume aside, they are rare.
At the risk of perpetuating another off-topic discussion a little more, the fashion which really did confine the arms was the zip-fastened capes endemic in British fashion in the early 1970s. “Classic” capes had always been generously cut and fastened at the collar, so that the wearer had the option of either the cape swinging loose with much freedom of movement, or wrapping up in the garment, but still with the ability to break free in a moment. These new capes were mostly cut much more to the figure, and fastened with the normal style of zipper, from the bottom upwards. Thus the wearer had no option but to fasten all the way down to the hem, trapping her arms relatively tightly to her sides.
Mostly, only relatively small slits were cut for the hands to pop through, and this was often insufficient to allow for much length of reach. One of the problems caused was the difficulty of holding shopping – hold it inside the cape and you can’t pick it up from the counter (you could only reach downwards); hold it outside and your arms aren’t straight, achy after a while, and you can’t easily put the bags on the ground. I also remember girls having problems getting up from the bus seat (can’t reach the grab rail, and difficult to get up in a moving bus with your arms trapped inside), and one in particular having difficulty eating in a bowling alley cafe because, while seated, her cape was pulled tightly round her body and her arms could hardly move.
A cape I saw once took the problem further by having zip closures on the hand slits, The pull for the zips was on the outside, which raised the interesting thought that it might not be possible to open them from inside, which given the tightness and length of the cape might then cause problems reaching the main zip. Fascinating!
Getting back to hobble skirts before I get banned, a rich source of interest over the years has been London’s Alternative Fashion Week, held in March of each year. This is a showcase for young designers and colleges, with a fair few hobble skirts, including obvious fetish ones (mainly rubber, some leather) as well as elegant tailored ones and everything in between; some of these have been very tight indeed. Obviously there are many other fashions there too; the diversity is great.
The reason I mention this here is that there have also been a number of designs which restrict the arms too, especially around 6-7 years ago when some of the major Japanese fashion designers were doing this. Examples have included arms bound entirely inside the body, overlength sleeves tied in the back like a straitjacket, sleeves joined back into the body at the cuff (like hands in pockets, but impossible to take them out), sleeves joined together in a single tube (one, in tough rubber, had the sleeves pulled behind the back and then joined in a continuous loop around the front - this looked impossible to get out of even with help!), and a couple where two models have been joined in a single garment. None of these would have been possible to escape from without help. Of course these were all catwalk sightings, I have never seen anything like them on the street.
Back to hobble skirts, this prompts another question – back in the Poiret era of the 1900s were hobble dresses ever of the earlier Victorian style where the wearer was dependant on a servant for her release? It is a strange thought that the wealthy submitted their freedom to the extent that they could hardly move, nor even go to the loo, without the assistance of somebody else!
Re: sightings
by
Art Foster
Posted
: 2005-10-31 23:37
Speaking of capes, in Victorian times there were various types of mantles worn by women that looked like a cross between a coat and a cape. These were always hard to figure out from pictures, but once at a historical costume event, I had the great delight to help a woman into one. Actually, she had asked for help, because getting into it was tricky. She had to get her arms into the sleeves, but these were attached down the side of the coat clear to the elbow! The attachment seemed to go down the back somehow, making the back of the garment look like a cape, only fitted to the body. After the elbow, the sleeves were independant, so she could move her hands about, but the fact that the sleeves were fitted close and attached in the back meant that she couldn't move her elbows away from her body, especially forward, making it impossible to reach anything. The coat buttoned in the front and she was able to do these up herself, but when I commented that she couldn't move her arms much, she said, "yeah, they're really tethered. I had to drive like this," and proceded to demonstrate how she had to drive with her arms clamped down. Her coat, which was an authentic antique from something like 1870's or 80's, drew a lot of admiration. These people loved finding and getting into these kinds of things.
It didn't help in getting the coat on that her victorian dress sleeves were very tight. The dress itself was otherwise not binding, but I think she mixed periods a little, because her mantle may easily have gone over the very narrow, columnar dresses of the 1870's. What a great combination: a mantle holding the arms at the sides worn over a narrow hobble dress! Obviously, I did a little research after this, and found pictures of these in historical fashion books, such as reprints from Godey's Ladies Book. This was a common combination, and the ladies were wonderfully upright and elegant. The mantles looked good over bustles as well. Especially when I found out what these capes/mantles were like on the inside, and the effect upon the wearer's mobility.
Incidently, though I haven't seen one of these close-up, another intriguing cape is the sling sleeved wrap, where the forearms are held in sling-like sleeves. Can't wait to see a real one.
To Rebel: the snug zippered capes sound wonderful, and if you happen to know where there are pictures of them, that would be great. And yes, even regular London Fashion Week can be great, and there is a school, the name of which is not coming to me right now, that does a lot of interesting things in their graduate runway show. I'll have to look up Alternative Fashion Week. London is great! My girlfriend, when she was younger, once stayed at a hostel in london where a girl asked for her help in getting into a straitjacket to go out on a date! (I certainly would have helped!)
Firstview.com has got to have the best array of pics, plenty of long narrow things, with some cape-like tops that envelope the arms, and if she doesn't wear much under that... well, she can't raise her arms without giving a show. It gives the same suspense as a skirt does on the legs (if she wants to move freely, she has to raise it) or a strapless gown (too much movement and something pops out). It just rivets the eyes. And if you want raising the arms to not even be an option, try Icarius, Hussein Chalayan, and Commes des Garcons with Rei Kawakubo (spelling may not be right!). Among others.
Yes, the hobbleskirts - and tops - are there, if the women have the panache to wear them.
When I get a chance, I have microfilm reprints taken from the New York Times 1910-14, with a few great short articles on real hobbleskirts during their heyday, and I could type these in. I have to dig them out of a box somewhere first, so it might be a while.
I still can't believe those celebrity pics of Mariah Carey. What an amazingly small hem, with only a tiny slit! Those are legs you just want to play with! (Or at least go dancing with!)
Re: sightings
by
Rebbel49
Posted
: 2005-11-03 14:07
I very rarely see photos of the 1970s capes - nor for that matter are they often metioned in fashion history, but I can assure you they were there! Maybe it was confined to the UK, I didn't travel much in those days.
I'm not sure, Art, what you mean by the sling sleeved wrap, although Vexed Generation - a London based company - produced a "liberty wrap" a few years ago, which could be worn in a number of ways, including with the arms sealed inside,like a straitjacket (by the way, I also knew of a girl going to a party in a staritjacket!). The wraps were made for both men and women.
Getting back to the main subject, I would certainly like to see what those NY Times articles said, so please be eencouraged to dig them out asap!
London is indeed a great city to see fashions, but sadly sightings of seriously hobbling skirts is at a bit of a low ebb at the moment; maybe the colder weather will encourage them - its still unseasonably warm here at the moment.
Re: sightings
by
Art Foster
Posted
: 2005-11-10 01:35
To rebel: About the NY times articles - I'm sorry, I never got the chance to dig them out before having to leave town - I'll be back in January, and I'll look for them then. Hopefully they'll be worth waiting for.
About hobble dresses from the nineteen teens: I doubt these were as hard to slip in and out of as the victorian dresses. This period was thought of as freeing women from the bondage of corsets and layers of petticoats. Clothes were much lighter and more delicate, especially evening gowns. Day dresses were perhaps more solidly sewn, but the fit more relaxed everywhere but around the lower legs. This was a gay, happy period, with lots of dancing to ragtime music (crazy wild "animal" dances) and other social innovations. Young women adopted the "debutante slouch", and good posture has yet to return.
Of course, once a lady put on a hobble dress and went about town, even if she tired of struggling to walk anywhere there wasn't much she could do about it, was there? Slits were not yet accepted, nor pulling the skirt up (if even possible). She would need to live with her choice for at least that day.
Of course, she still might have a long line of tiny back buttons that are hard to reach. Who knows?
Re: sightings
by
Maurice
Posted
: 2005-11-18 22:04
I was at a wedding last weekend. Being November, everybody was wearing their warm winter clothes. One of the female guests caught my eye, or rather, her outfit did: a slim, well dressed lady in her late forties I guess, she was wearing a tweed jacket over a brown, calf length cord skirt and boots with a small heel. The skirt hung almost straight from the hips, with barely any flare and, I thought surprisingly, no split. On the short walk from the registry office to the reception, being held at a hotel just around the corner, I noticed she walked with conspicuously short steps; from the fact that the skirt kept catching her lightly around her calves I could tell that she was reaching the limits of the hem, yet trying not to attract attention to it. Stepping back up on to the pavement after crossing the road required a sort of twisting / skipping movement where she almost had to jump on to the kerb, but it was done most elegantly. The final approach to the hotel was up a sloping tarmac driveway, and I watched as her pace slowed compared to others around her as everyone else subconsciously lengthened their stride to cope with the gradient but, of course, she could not. In fact she put one hand down, discreetly resting it on the front of her thigh as she walked, and I was expecting to see her slide the skirt up an inch or two - but she didn't. Upon arrival in the hotel foyer I noticed the exertion of the short walk had given her quite a rosy complexion! It makes me wonder though why was a skirt like that made without a split, or any other means of walking naturally in it? Very tastefully, conservatively styled it made up what looked to be an expensive, 'country lady' outfit. I'm sure that most women buying such a skirt wouldn't expect to be hobbled by it, and yet this lady was clearly experiencing some difficulty. Was the skirt designed to be restrictive, to encourage gentle, lady-like behaviour, or is it simply the case that whoever designed / machined it didn't appreciate, or care, about the consequences of a long straight skirt with a rigid inflexible hem? Not that I'm complaining, of course, but in the 'real' world it must seem to the wearer that she puts up with an awful lot of everyday inconvenience for such a small, basic omission in the design.
Re: sightings
by
long skirt fan
Posted
: 2005-11-21 07:28
That does seem unusual, Maurice. Perhaps the lady's skirt was specially made. If it was off the peg, then perhaps it was intended for a taller woman; was this lady short?
My latest buy is quite hobbling, though not as elegant! It seems to be aimed at younger women: it seems to be made of nylon, and it has a drawstring waist. It's a size 8 (US 10?) and is 39" long, so unless you're a beanpole, that's ankle length at least. From the hips down it has scarcely any flare. It has a narrow contrasting stripe down each side. Set into each of these is a triangular panel that can be zipped open or shut, but they don't unzip up very far, only up to the top of the calves, and the skirt is still hobbling around there. Of course I keep those panels zipped shut. It looks better, too, with a straighter line and the stripes staying narrow all the way down. Then, the hem is only 43" all the way around. I'd love to see girls walking in such long, narrow skirts!
Re: sightings
by
Albert
Posted
: 2005-12-08 09:54
Thank you, Mr Foster and Rebbel49, for your fascinating observations. This urbane discussion on fashion was a delight to find.
Vexed Generation have opened up their back catalogue for browsing, and that "Wrap Liberation" jacket can be seen here: http://www.archive.vexed.co.uk/vexed2005/womens_site/womens/jackets.php
The accompanying text intriguingly mentions that the garment was supposed to be a statement of solidarity with the homeless and was originally inspired by Christian Dior's "La Normandie", "a jacket without sleeves or armholes." (To which, unfortunately, I can't seem to find any other reference.)
http://www.archive.vexed.co.uk/vexed2005/womens_site/womens/jackets.php
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great movie scenes
by
art foster
Posted
: 2005-10-26 15:54
Last Update
: 2006-01-24 10:44
Two of the best hobble skirt sequences I've seen: in "Two Weeks Notice", Sandra Bullock has an extended scene scurrying in a long narrow bridesmaid dress and high heels, her arms in a shawl tied in back suggestive of confinement. This was a fine surprise in an already decent chic flick, and by itself worth the price of the movie.
In a considerably dumber movie, "The Sweetest Thing", but again, worth the price, Cameron Diaz dons a tight midi length skirt (and high heels) and spends a considerable amount of time plaintifly trying to get around in it, even calling it "bondage". Yum!
Re: great movie scenes
by
art foster
Posted
: 2006-01-24 10:30
Another must-see movie: "The Prince and the Showgirl" with Marilyn Monroe and Lawrence Olivier. It takes place in 1912 or thereabouts, and Marilyn spends most of the movie in a skinny, confining gown. She spends one scene scurrying about trying to get away from Olivier.
In another Marilyn Monroe movie, "Let's Make Love", she rehearses a dance in tights, but the actual performance of the dance is in a gown so skinny I'm surprised she didn't have to practice her dance wearing it.
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Absailing in a Skirt!
by
Beth
Posted
: 2005-10-15 02:35
Last Update
: 2005-10-15 02:35
Hi
I posted a while ago about when I ended up playing footy in a long denim skirt, well I've another story from last weekend. Our school was fund raising by people paying to absail off the sports hall roof. Well we went along to watch. There weren't many people having a go so they tried to persuade me and my friends to have a go. Well eventually most of my friends agreed one by one and had a go, and then it was my turn. Trouble was I was wearing a skirt that I had bought off ebay a few days ago, it was heavy non-stretch denim and came just below knee length and was v tight, clamping my thighs together! I've tried to post a link to a picture of it that was the pic on e-bay.
Well the problem with a skirt was that the harness has straps that go between your legs that is impossible to do with a skirt. However one of my friends suggested that I put on the harness under my skirt! After a bit of pressure I eventually agreed and I took the harness inside the school and one of my friends helped me put it on. The weather was quite chilly so luckily I had a pair of thick black tights on which stopped the straps being too uncomfortable between my legs! After a struggle I just about managed to pull my skirt up over the harness and do it up. The belt part of the harness was just above the waist band of the skirt so you could still attach the carabiner to the front of it without any trouble. There were also straps than went over your shoulders and fasted across your chest. I was wearing a padded body warmer so we did the straps up and I body warmer back on over the top.
Well I was a sight I can tell u, absailing down from the roof dressed like that! The absailing part wasn't too difficult cause you are really just hanging from the harness, the most difficult bit was getting up the ladder onto the roof in the first place! In fact it was such fun I even had a second go. However the 2nd time when I got to about a metre from the ground they stopped paying the rope out so I was left hanging there. I soon realized what was happening as one of my friends came running out of the school with a camera. She took several pics of me whilst I was helplessly hanging there kicking out and struggling in my skirt! Still it was all good fun! At last I was let down and we stayed around a bit watching a few more people having a go until it was time for them to pack up. Trouble was by this time someone had locked the school and as I didn't fancy dropping my skirt in public to take the harness of I kept it on until I got to my friends house 2 hours later!! Luckily it wasn't too noticeable under the skirt and body warmer.
Has anyone else had anything similar happen, when you’ve wanted to do something like that which u weren't expecting and u attempted it in unsuitable clothes?!
http://img448.imageshack.us/img448/3461/sk19zs.jpg
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German film on video page
by
sarah
Posted
: 2005-10-12 21:10
Last Update
: 2005-10-12 21:10
Can we expect to see any clips or stills from Die Feuerzangenbowle on the video page at any time? How authentic is/are the hobble skirt(s)and how long do we see it/them on screen?
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A very long walk to school...
by
Wendy
Posted
: 2005-10-12 11:14
Last Update
: 2006-01-13 02:39
I thought I would share a story with you all. I typically wear long tight skirts to school , and yesterday was no exception. All was well with weather in the high 80's and lots of sun. I found out that my typical parking lot about two blocks from class was being re-surfaced or fixed or something. I then had to drive around to find another place to park. The only spot that I could find was about 10- 12 blocks away. With time getting late I not only had to go many times further , but do so at a pretty fast pace.
My long skirt had little stretch and made for really small steps. I stopped to unzip the bottom as I started to realize that I was going to be very late. and as I started getting beyond hot trying to run in small steps in the heat. I stopped and found that the zipper was hopeless and stuck all the way down. It took me more than 20 minutes to get to class. I arrived late with sweat on my face and feet that could stand no more running in my four inch heel sandals.
I made it through the class with a few odd looks. My skirts usually don't look fetish , they look more fashion and uncomfortable. I can step about 12 inches at a time in the skirt that I wore yesterday. I really enjoyed the sensation on the walk back to my car. My boyfriend gave me a great foot rub last night and that made the day a good thing.
Today I assume that all will be the same for parking, so I am wearing a long tight black spandex skirt and black tall boots with quite tall heels as well. I am looking forward to the long walk as long as I have a bit more time to get there. The temp is again in the 80's , but I hope having a bit more time will leave me more attractive looking at my class. I am not info the fetish style clothes much, but clothes chosen for being tighly fitted can still offer a lot of fun out in public. Wendy
Re: A very long walk to school...
by
Guest
Posted
: 2005-10-13 00:19
I wish you had been at my school! Are you a teacher or a pupil? I thought you were a pupil until you said you were driving to school...
I guess you are in the US or somewhere with the temperature in the 80s. It's almost all school uniform here in the uk but I still remember many tight fitting skirts at school, as long as they were the right colour the style and length didn't seem to matter too much as long as they weren't too short. All the teachers were mainly frumpy with granny clothes!
Let us know how you get on with your tight skirts at school!
Re: A very long walk to school...
by
Rebbel49
Posted
: 2005-10-13 15:16
Ah yes, memories of school uniforms in the past! I went to school myself in the miniskirt years (OK, 1960s!), and jolly good it was too. But he 1980s and early 90s - that's when some of our local schools seemed to have competitions to see who could make their skirts the tightest. The funny thing is that it seemed to be only some schools - many didn't participate at all, others were pretty extreme. Most specialised in just below the knee, often with no slit and very tight at the hem - it made getting on the bus a very fine sight. The girls at one school though had much longer skirts, but often nearly as tight at the hem. Certainly that school didn't seem to mind what material was used as long as the colour was nearly "right", the other schools seemed to insist that the correct material waas used, but were clearly happy with whatever shapes the skirts were modified into.
Re: A very long walk to school...
by
Guest
Posted
: 2005-10-14 01:57
Yes, I was at school in the 80's and i can remember some very tight skirts. Nearly all the skirts were straight and at least knee lenth or below and I can remember several ankle-length ones. MAny girls walked around with one hand hitching their skirt up a bit so they could walk more easily. Some skirts were really figure-hugging and as you mention, it was a real sight when they had clinmb stairs or get on the coach to go home!
Re: A very long walk to school...
by
Maurice
Posted
: 2005-10-20 15:21
When I was at school - late 70s - I recall it was pencil skirts that were the emerging trend. And after the boring, shapeless school skirts which had gone before this new style seemed very exciting. The fashion was to wear them long, but far from competing to make them as tight as possible, the contest between the female pupils seemed to be one of who could get away with wearing the highest split. Splits were worn at the front, back or sides and in the most adventurous cases went from calf right up to mid thigh.
A girl who I knew at the time (in fact I still see her around now, so I won't mention her name - even though I doubt she is a visitor to this site), always into the latest fashions and trends, arrived at school one morning wearing a new, longer length pencil skirt with a very long split at the back. For a couple of days she was envy of her friends and all of the boys loved it. But then mid week I suddenly noticed her taking tiny, mimsy steps as she shuffled along the school corridor - and soon realized why: her skirt split was completely sewn shut. Apparently her father had fiercely objected to his daughter dressing "like a slut" and made her sew the split up the previous evening. I remember her protesting to her friends about the humiliation she felt being made to sew up the skirt (and, I guess, because of the resulting baby steps which she was now reduced to taking). I thought she looked terrific; the split had been crudely, but very effectively sewn up by hand and there was no chance of those stitches breaking. Watching her struggle up the stairs and having to almost break into a run just to keep up with her friends as they walked around the school was a picture that stays with me to this day. Before long, however, common sense prevailed and when she returned to school after the weekend her skirt split had been unpicked and resewn (by machine)with a necessary - although much reduced split - let into the hem. It looked much neater, and although she no longer had to hobble to get around her movements must still have been restricted. Originally her skirt must have had almost an eighteen inch split, but after modification I guess it was less than six inches.
There are other instances of tight skirts which I remember from school, but I think this was without doubt one of the finest!
Re: A very long walk to school...
by
Rebbel49
Posted
: 2005-10-26 16:33
That story reminds me of an episode of the UK school-based soap Grange Hill, sometime back in the late 1980s I think. The character played by Susan Tully (who later moved on to Eastenders)wore a "just above the knee" skirt with a slit; the headteacher made her sew it up whch resulted in her being able to take only small steps. Fiction, of course, and probably not as spectacular as Maurice's example, but good viewing all the same.
I don't remember our local schools having high slit competitions - those that wanted to show their legs did so by having very short skirts. The long ones were almost always without any slit, and it really seemed to be the restriction (and attraction to the boys) that was the driving force and the cause of fun.
Re: A very long walk to school...
by
Jayne
Posted
: 2006-01-13 02:39
My husband likes me to wear an ankle length hobble skirt when we go out to a restaurant or the theatre sometimes. It's black leather, very tight of course and I usually wear boots underneath. It takes me ages to go any distance of course, but he loves to see me take very small steps in my heels. Going upstairs is most difficult, of course, as the leather is so very tight, but he really enjoys it, and so do I, to be honest.
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Are there any dutch ladies here that wear hobble skirts/dresses?
by
Erik
Posted
: 2005-10-10 14:35
Last Update
: 2005-10-10 14:35
Hello, I would like to get in touch with dutch ladies that love to wear hobbleshirts or dresses and that would maybe love to pose in front of my camera.
I look forward to hear from you, also if you do not like to pose in front of the camera but maybe like to go out sometime when you wear your hobble skirt or dress.
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Scarf Discussion
by
Admin
Posted
: 2005-10-07 10:30
Last Update
: 2005-10-29 06:04
Moving the scarf discussion to this thread to avoid topic confusion.
scarf discussion
by
James
Posted
: 2005-01-01 06:22
Sarah
Your "disaster" sounds wonderful! I wish there were more women in London who cared for such a splendid 50's look (there is something about the combination of tweed and silk, and especially in the form of a tight skirt and Hermes scarf!)
Do mail me if you would like to chat further.
James
scarf discussion
by
sarah
Posted
: 2005-01-05 07:53
I'm pleased you like the style! Actually, I think I'm right in saying that wearing a Hermes headscarf tied near the mouth didn't come into fashion till the late 'sixties at the earliest- at least, that's when I first saw it done.Originally it was younger, smarter London women who wore (wear?) their scarves like this as opposed to under the jaw in the ugly, practical way favoured by old ladies and the Queen. I think the original idea was supposed to be to have the knot on the tip of the chin, but it usually slips up to rest in the dip between chin and mouth.Infuriating at first, but fun once you realize what it looks like. As Hermes designs usually favour lots of straps and buckles (horse harness themes) I always feel a scarf worn this way is a bit bondage-flavoured and risque! A perfect accompaniment to a too-narrow long tweed skirt for a bit of elegant restriction .It is almost as difficult to talk with the scarf in place as it is to walk in a hobble skirt, and the combination of the two is great fun if you're in the mood. And the great thing is, you can walk around in public in the smartest places without attracting attention! Thoroughly recommended for the more conservative-minded, but probably of less interest to the punkier hobbler!
scarf discussion
by
James
Posted
: 2005-01-05 18:21
Hmm, well you'd certainly attract attention from me! I much prefer the "traditional" (older?) style of Hermes, rather than the (newer?) trendier styles - like you say, all those belts and buckles...Have you got a substantial collection? And do you wear them even when you *really* have no need of a scarf?!
James
scarf discussion
by
sarah
Posted
: 2005-01-05 18:49
Does one ever really "need" to wear a Hermes headscarf? They're no use in the rain, in fact rain can damage them. Also, worn with a single knot (which is the most attractive way) they have a tendency to slip so they're not good in high winds either.I actually think they're best on quite fine days because the sunshine sets off the colours so well, although they can be hot to wear in the height of summer. A fine, fresh Spring or Autumn day is usually best, and sunglasses finish off the look. I'm a real stickler for the position of the knot though- it absolutely must be as near the lips as one can manage, regardless of being able to talk normally. I take it you're familiar with Hermes scarves worn this way ? It's quite rare nowadays to see them worn on the head at all, let alone with the knot in the right position! I thought it was almost an extinct style, but of course I haven't been to London recently and you'd hardly ever see a knot worn high up near the mouth on any one but a very smart London woman, even when the style was at its most popular.
scarf discussion
by
Posted
: 2005-01-06 18:39
Sarah - yes I'm very familiar with the scarf tied in such a fashion (in fact, as luck would have it, I saw just such a lady today in Piccadilly - a midnight blue Brides de Gala since you ask...). I do rather like to see a proper knot (you might call it a double knot, as I assume the "knot" you are referring to is more of a twist?, but this shortens the tails somewhat, which detracts from the overall experience. Of course the edges of the scarf should skim the cheekbones, and expose half the hair on top, so it is almost tied diagonally on the head.
Hmm, well, as this is supposed to be a hobble skirt forum we should probably stop there or we will infuriate the other readers. I do so hope you will mail me so we can continue our chat?
Yours
James
scarf discussion
by
sarah
Posted
: 2005-01-06 20:33
Well spotted James, and well described too. I take it she wasn't sporting a narrow skirt or you would have described it in equally loving detail. A scarf worn high on the chin does inevitably follow and flatter the cheekbones just as you say. The hair is uncovered at the front of course (as VERY distinct from the unflattering Islamic look),and from the side the folded edge of the scarf has a very extreme slant, following a tight line from mouth to crown of head, and looking from a distance as if the wearer has all but gagged herself- at least that was my impression when I first saw the style in Bond Street many years ago. As for the knot, I think you'll find a Hermes scarf tied in a "double" knot just below the mouth would look and feel rather cumbersome, partly because the silk twill fabric is quite substantial and partly because of the generous size of the Hermes square - I think everyone I've seen wearing a Hermes scarf on the front of the chin this way has used a simple wrap-over knot , or "twist", otherwise the knot juts out rather inelegantly. This does mean you have to be prepared for a bit of re-adjustment (one's scarf has a tendency to slip down at the rear of the head) but I think the result is worth it. I completely agree about the length of the ends- much better long and graceful, as achieved with the single knot. Such small details, some will think, but so important to get right. Apologies to all who find this dialogue tedious, but I would prefer not to enter into direct email correspondence with an internet acquaintance. I have however found it an unexpected pleasure to converse with someone who knows and appreciates the delights of the Hermes scarf worn as discussed, and thanks to the Hobble Skirt forum for their patience! By the way, James, next time you see a scarf being worn this way, be sure to approach the wearer and ask for directions, or use some other innocent excuse to get her to speak, because that's when the fun starts (if you're feeling wicked!) I'll bet she immediately becomes flustered because, however superbly and unapproachably elegant she may appear, she's only human, and in my experience it really is so challenging trying to hold a conversation when your scarf is knotted up to your lips. Nevertheless, if she pulls the scarf down to speak, she's obviously not a true devotee. Great fun for you- do report your results- or perhaps you already have anecdotes to share!
scarf discussion
by
James
Posted
: 2005-01-07 19:42
Regrettably no - she was wearing a distinctly unflattering pair of trousers! I did see a rather fine red pencil skirt earlier in the day though, with a lethal looking pair of red stilettoes with (swoon!) metal heels...
I had to laugh at your comment about stopping her for directions - I have done just that (50 yards round the corner from my office...) to one headscarved lady, just to have the joy of seeing her in close up!
Re the email - I won't press it, but I am respectful of others here who really won't get (or want to get!) what we're on about! You can of course always create a completely anonymous hotmail account, and I don't bite (well if there was an Hermes scarf knot presented to me I might chew a little...)
Yours
James
scarf discussion
by
sarah
Posted
: 2005-01-08 14:06
Was your scarf lady able to speak properly or did you think she was finding her scarf a (delightful) hindrance?
scarf discussion
by
James
Posted
: 2005-01-09 11:59
Regrettably not - she was midway between fetish fashion and practicality by having the (single or twist) knot below her chin rather than over it. It did move rather enticingly as she spoke though!
J
scarf discussion
by
sarah
Posted
: 2005-01-09 13:03
Couldn't have been me then- I wouldn't be seen dead with my scarf knotted under my chin, and nor would anyone with any style. If you do see someone doing it wrong, suggest she moves her knot up to just below the lower lip. It's not really fetish fashion you know- that's just my interpretation of how it looks. It's supposed to be a very upper class touch of elegance. I've been told it was originally a signal that your boyfriend or husband was a Guardsman, as that's how they wear the chinstrap of their helmet or "bearskin". Is that true? Good hunting!
scarf discussion
by
James
Posted
: 2005-01-09 14:16
Hmm, no, I've misled you. There is a spectrum of knots, from what you are describing (where one knots the scarf just below the mouth) to the frankly ghastly knot almost at the throat (usually seen on mean small scarves often made of artificial material...). In the middle is the knot actually *on* the point of the chin, which is what the lady I was describing was wearing. I suppose to stay on the scarf itself must tension in the opposite direction, so the further forward the knot on the face, the further back the folded edge will sit. Thus the fashion faux pas of a throat knot is compounded by the folded edge sitting far too near the forehead...ah the trials and tribulations of being a scarf admirer!!
scarf discussion
by
sarah
Posted
: 2005-01-09 19:07
I find keeping it on the point of the chin almost impossible. It is very dependent on the shape of the wearer's chin. In fact, just below the mouth is much more secure, although it definitely restricts one's ability to speak, as previously mentioned. My husband once asked me (a long time ago when we were first encountering this uniquely London-based scarf fashion) if I knew where "Pharis" was, as he had just asked a lady in Kensington High Street where her scarf was from ,and she had apparently replied, quite clearly, "Hermes in Pharis". Her scarf was tied so high up it was brushing against her lips and playing tricks with her pronunciation. Quite amusing, we thought. The strange thing is, neither of us has ever seen any reference to the wearing of a headscarf in such a distinctive way in any fashion magazine, and we have always wondered how the style has become so popular for so long in certain circles. Was it started by someone influential, e.g. Royalty (I know they share my weakness for the Hermes headscarf, but I don't remember seeing any of them with the knot at"maximum elevation" as my husband calls it.)
scarf discussion
by
Sarah-Jane
Posted
: 2005-08-02 17:48
Sarah,
Well to-day was the day i wore a scarf tied in the new style. With the scarf i wore a white blouse,a short black tight skirt(I am still of an age that i can wear them), matching jacket,sheer black tights and high heels.I had an appointment with the hair dresser.I know the above clothes may sound a bit over the top for an appointment with ones hair dresser,but i like to look smart at all times.I wear the short skirt because it is easier to sit in the chair for a while and be able to stretch ones legs,but be restricted further up.
Now for the big moment i selected a scarf and tied it over my head and fussed with the knot untill it just brushed my lips.Heaven!!!! It was then a short drive to the shop,with the scarf slipping a lot.It's amazing how much we move our heads whilst driving. I parked the car adjusted the scarf,got out of the car,to be met with a slight gust of wind which blew the scarf off my head.I tied the scarf again!!!.Asi started to walk across the car park towards the shop,my mobile phone started to trill in my handbag. Don't panic i thought,answer it,at this point in time forgetting that you have tied your headscarf in a new way. What came out of my mouth is as follows:- (Wello wearer wayne fere) roughly translated is:-(Hello Sarah-Jane here) As an experiment put a scarf on and try and say my name.I will be interested in the out come. Hope you enjoy reading this its a bit of fun. I am going to master this if it takes years!!! I shall tell you about the shop in due course!!!
scarf discussion
by
sarah
Posted
: 2005-08-02 18:20
I do believe you're hooked, Sarah-Jane. If you're persevering with wearing your scarf that way it's because you now know how amazing it looks, and you don't mind a few minor setbacks. Things do get a bit easier with practice, and you'll find it stays in place better as you get more used to it.I hope your scarf is a Hermes as they really do stay put best for some reason, probably the size and weight. Well worth the extra money. All the straps and buckles in the designs look appropriate too! You're right that speaking is always a challenge. Looking forward to the next "instalment" of your exploits.
scarf discussion
by
Sarah-Jane
Posted
: 2005-08-04 17:08
Sarah,
Haven't forgotten the next installment.My husband is at home on leave at the moment so we are spending some time to-gether,going out visiting friends etc.Will be back in the forum in a few days time.Will tell you what he thinks of the new look.
Sarah-Jane
scarf discussion
by
sarah
Posted
: 2005-09-01 08:17
Where are you Sarah Jane, I'm on tenterhooks!
scarf discussion
by
Sarah-Jane
Posted
: 2005-09-01 17:22
Hi Sarah,
Sorry to have been away for such a while A few days turned out to be a bit longer.Whilst my husband was on leave we received the wonderful news that we had become grandparents. Our daughter Anna now has a daughter of her own. Needless to say we had to see our daughter and baby,but the trouble is they live in Pebble Beach in California which isn't a five minute trip away. I have been back home a couple of days now and am just getting round to answering e-mails etc. and seeing what has been going on in internet sites,and of course found your message,wondering where i am. The next part of the scarf story will follow this weekend. Sarah-Jane
scarf discussion
by
Skirted_Flip
Posted
: 2005-09-02 03:53
I was thinking Sarah-Jane had a hobble skirt accident while visiting the family event. :p But that's great to hear! Congratulations!
scarf discussion
by
sarah
Posted
: 2005-09-02 08:43
Congratulations on the new arrival, Sarah-Jane, and looking forward to your scarf-wearing (and hobble-skirted of course) exploits later this weekend.
scarf discussion
by
Sarah-Jane
Posted
: 2005-09-04 10:06
Hi Sarah,
Now back to the story. I finished my phone conversation.I must be honest and say i did pull the knot of the scarf down a little to speak,but put it back when i had finished talking and continued walking to the shop.On getting to the shop i was met by a lady and push chair,looking a little stressed coming out of the door,with child on board which duly threw its soft toy onto the pavement. Now i was faced with a dilema.The polite thing to do would be to pick the toy up and give it back to the mother,but this required me to bend down and retrieve the toy first.As you will remember i was wearing a short,tight skirt,not really designed for bending over in,but i was not to be out done.I kept my back as straight as i could and bent my legs at the knee keeping the rest of my body as up right as possible so as not to fall over.As i was about to grasp the toy a hand shot out from the vicinity of the push chair and grabed one of the tails of my scarf and with a tug the scarf was removed from my head and i fell forward onto one knee.I managed to pick myself up as lady like as i could and gave the toy back to the mother who was busy trying to get my scarf back from the child with as little damage as possible.The lady thanked me for my help and went on her way and i entered the shop as calmly as i could,knowing full well that the girls in the shop and other ladies in there had seen all this happen.I walked up to the reception counter,a little flushed and slightly out of breath and said Mrs Hamilton-Owen, i believe i have an appointment at eleven.The girl marked my name in the book and asked me to take a seat and said a stylist would be along shortly.After my hair had been done i tied my scarf back on to protect it,paid and left the shop.No one said anything to me about the incident or the way in which i tied my scarf,but i expect they were talking a lot when i left. The only thing i will say about wearing the scarf the new way is that it sits further back on the head thus you fringe and hair at the front of your head isn't covered by the scarf so a small adjustment to my hair was required when i arrived home. Do you find this is the case when you wear your Scarves Sarah?
Well i hope the wait for the next part has been worth while and you enjoy reading this.
Sarah-Jane
scarf discussion
by
sarah
Posted
: 2005-09-04 11:44
Sarah-Jane, thanks for the update. I can tell from your detailed account, especially the little comment about the front of your hair being more uncovered, that you really have tried the scarf style I love, and I get the feeling that your minor mishaps aren't going to put you off. Has anyone at all actually told you how good it looks, or is everyone being totally oblivious? I sometimes wonder if it really looks as dramatic and unusual as I think! You certainly had an eventful time- is it going to deter you from further wearings?
scarf discussion
by
sarah
Posted
: 2005-09-04 20:08
Sarah-Jane, I've just remembered a little detail about wearing my Hermes headscarf knotted just below the lips- my husband gets very excited when I try to kiss him and the large silk knot prevents my lips from reaching his. Just a small point, but I'd love to hear the reaction you get if you try it! There'd be no ignoring the scarf in those circumstances, that's for sure. I think the secret of the appeal is you look so regal and superb, and yet you can hardly function at all! So true of most things men like women to wear- tight skirts of course, but also high shoes, hair worn over the eyes, too-long fingernails-the list goes on! We must be crazy, but it's such fun once you get into it and figure out how to press the buttons and get the results!
scarf discussion
by
Jayne
Posted
: 2005-09-05 02:51
Well, I had a new disaster. As we all know, I like my damsel in distress stuff. Especially my clay/mud/quicksand. Well, I got the bright idea to go to a new place I heard about yesterday. Being a holiday weekend, I knew it would be totally deserted. Bad idea. I had to use the infamous black hobbleskirt you see on the photo pages. To make a long story short, I wiggled out onto the clay and started to sink as planned. I went down to my thighs when I noticed something was different about this clay. It was much finer than I had ever dealt with before. Ok, not a big deal. I wiggle and twist some more and ZOOM I must have hit an air pocket and released it, because I went from my big butt keeping me afloat to it becoming an anchor in about half a second. I could feel the clay getting inside my hobbleskirt, which weighed me down even more. Anyway, I ended up finally displacing enough clay at about where my nose was above the surface. Yeah, picture that. The top of my upper lip and above were all that was visible. I couldn't move too fast or else I'd go under, and I was really concerned that would be it for me. Anyway, I did get out. But now the real fun started. In about 2 minutes of me getting out and slithering to solid ground, the water drained out of my hobbleskirt and the clay in it. It bacame solid like cement!!!! I literally couldn't bend at all!! So I struggled up to my feet and hopped to my car about 100 yards away. Then I had to drive. I tried to take the skirt off, but it was solid like a cast. I gave new meaning to the term "column dress". Well, I'm not quite able to drive as normal, so I got pulled over by a cop, probably thinking I was drunk as Labor Day is the last party of the summer. He walks up and looks in the window and just stares. I had no excuse, how could I? After he runs my license he lets me go. But he said something like I might want a less restrictive skirt, and how it made me look hippy to be honest. I was so embarassed I wanted to die. Will I wear a hobbleskirt again? Of course. I just need to do it in a less conspicuous manner.
scarf discussion
by
Sarah-jane
Posted
: 2005-09-05 13:02
Hi Sarah,
In answer to you quetions on my up date i have had positive comments from my husband who likes the new scarf style and now refers to me as his "veiled Angel"as the headscarf hides some of my features, especially from the side as it looks as if you are chewing on the knot.I have found now as i am getting more adept at tying the scarf it does feel nice as it gently brushes the cheeks,but there is a nice feeling of tightness over the ears and futher back on the head along the diagonal line of the scarf.As for having strange comments uttered or looked at strangley,i have had none as yet,perhaps they will come.As for looking a strange way to wear a scarf,i think it no more stange than a lady friend of mine who covers her mouth with a chiffon scarf to keep the wind off her when she has her roof down on her little sports car.
You are also correct in thinking that a few minor set backs won't stop me from wearing headscaves in this way. As for kissing ones husband i never gave it a thought but i can see you point of view,and will let you know about that in due course.I also agree that the way in which we dress for ourselves and the men in our lives does at times make it difficult for us to perform the simplist of tasks ie last night i was going out and had had some false nails fitted on Saturday which made the putting on a pair of tights difficult because i was afraid of putting a hole in them. Before i finish, to-day i went for a fitting of a new tight,black velvet lined ankle length skirt,which is going to be buttoned down the back and is being copied from a picture of a Victorion ancestor of mine,but with a 21C twist to it.Will let you know how it progresses.It will be ideal to keep me warm as autumn moves into winter and of course finished off with a scarf.Oh before i go you mentioned pressing the right buttons,whilst my husband was home he tied the scarf on me on one occasion and to have the knot drawn up to the lips by your i found very sensuous!!!!
Sarah-Jane
scarf discussion
by
sarah
Posted
: 2005-09-06 19:00
Sarah-Jane, your new skirt sounds nice, but be sure to use strong button thread or you'll put someone's eye out with flying buttons if that toy-throwing brat makes you bend over again! Is it buttoned all the way down the back, or just the walking vent? Several skirts in my wardrobe have been modified with buttoned-up walking splits, which must of course be kept fastened (except the very bottom one if you're absolutely running for your life!)I do hope other participants in this forum try our scarf style, it would be great fun to start a little "Hermes scarf tied just under the mouth" club! I'm sure there was just such a thing based in the Chelsea and Kensington areas of London in the 1970's and '80's, because every smartly-dressed woman about town was sporting the look for several years. As the fashion magazines of the day seem to have failed to note the trend, one suspects the work of a "secret society"- I doubt it happened by chance! That's where my inspiration stems from, anyway. Sarah-Jane, how about a photo or two for the gallery section- your scarf should guarantee your anonymity! I wish I had the facilities to post one.
scarf discussion
by
Sarah-Jane
Posted
: 2005-09-08 16:29
Hi Sarah,
My new skirt buttons all the way down.It has no walking split,so i shall be taking short stides.I shall make sure that the buttons are sewn on tightly.It is definitely a skirt,not to bend over in much,if at all.The buttons are covered in the same material as the skirt.Instead of button holes i have asked for strong cord loops that hook over the buttons to fasten them,in keeping with the photo that the skirt is being copied from. With all my skirts i wear high heels either 3 or 4",but i am thinking of buying a pair of ankle boots to go with this skirt.I have seen some lovely lace up ones to keep restricted feel.
Like you i wish more people would try our way of wearing scarves.Do you think headscarfs are making a come back? I don't seem to see young girls wearing them now like in the 60's,but i feel it is important for ladies like us to carry on the trend so it doesn't die out altogether. I have been thinking about what you said about a club.Do you think ladies would post messages on a forum just dedicated to headscarf wearing? or is it a too specialised topic.Would like to know your views on this. Before i forget i was in town this morning and i saw a man out of the corner of my eye walking down the other side of the street to me,who kept throwing the occasional glance in my direction.Hope he liked my scarf etc.As regards to photos, at Christmas my husband is hoping to up grade our computer system so pictures then will probably be on the agenda.
Sarah-Jane
scarf discussion
by
Skid
Posted
: 2005-09-10 05:45
For Sarah and S-J, there are numerous scarf forums on yahoo if they are interested
scarf discussion
by
sarah
Posted
: 2005-09-23 08:29
skid, thanks but all the scarf sites I've tried have either been just into scarf bondage ( and full of fairly disgusting images too, I might add), or clubs devoted to vintage Hermes design collectors who think that once a Hermes scarf has been tied in a knot it has become worthless, which is quite simply insane. I think I'm right in saying there are no images anywhere on the internet of a headscarf being worn as we have been discussing, which is why I can't wait for Sarah-Jane to get her new computer so everyone can see what the fuss is about. I'm sorry if the topic has become boring to some, but I honestly love this little scarf style, and I think it has strong parallels with wearing restricting skirts, namely you can go out and about and indulge your secret romantic little fantasy without being arrested or anything!
scarf discussion
by
razzle
Posted
: 2005-09-26 20:05
Would just like to say I have absolutely adored reading Sarah & Sarah-Jane's headscarf posts - I too am a huge fan of ladies in headscarves (do agree with Sarah that there's no substitute for the weight & beauty of Hermes) and as for knotting under the lips, I am positively swooning at the thought. Thought this exceptionally elegant style was almost extinct, so hats off to you for keeping it alive.
Even living in London where fashions remain reasonably diverse, elegantly tied headscarves are all too rare. As a male headscarf admirer in my early thirties, can't help thinking I should have been born a couple of decades earlier ! Long live a gorgeous 'Brides de Gala' knotted just below the lips, ladies....
scarf discussion
by
sarah
Posted
: 2005-09-27 08:34
Thank you Razzle. I had no idea at first how sexy some men find wearing a Hermes scarf in that way. I was just copying a smart look I saw in London, and I'm fairly sure that many of the women I used to see around Chelsea and Knightsbridge were completely oblivious to the sex appeal of knotting their scarves so high up that they could barely speak when addressing shopkeepers, for example- it was just "the thing to do" if you could afford a Hermes, probably because it sets off the qualities of the scarf so well. One only really discovers the true appeal of little things like this when one's partner starts begging one to wear them long after fashion has moved on. A woman will probably try wearing anything, however impractical, while it is a current style, but it takes the persuasive powers of a close friend or partner to persevere with something so esoteric, so incredibly inconvenient to wear, and yet so undeniably sensual for both wearer and admirer alike. Anything for a quiet life, I suppose- I'm pleased, and more than a little relieved to hear that my husband is not the only lover of this look. As you say, it has become such a rare sight I was beginning to feel apprehensive about wearing it again now the cooler and windier Autumn weather is with us, but with fashion magazines referring to "classic Hitchcock heroines" and the like, I feel confident to carry on looking dramatically scarved for another season at least. I just hope no-one thinks I'm part of some obscure religious persuasion- what is it exactly that makes all these religious and ethnic groups think they need to hijack the wearing of headscarves? Thank goodness "my" style hasn't become adopted, I'd hate to be mistaken for an asylum seeker or something. No offence intended, but wearing a Hermes (although of course they are French-made) or Liberty of London 36" silk twill square knotted up near the lips is the mark of an elegant Englishwoman in my book, and can always be clearly recognised as such.
scarf discussion
by
Sarah-Jane
Posted
: 2005-09-27 16:44
Hi,
Thank you Skid for mentioning the yahoo sites,but i am afraid that a lot of them don't deal with the fashion aspect of wearing an elegantly tied headscarf in the manner in which i wear mine,but thanks all the same.
Thanks Razzle for your kind words.I always try to look my best when i go out.With winter now fast approaching a headscarf will be a must to keep the elements at bay.Reading your post i get the impression that you would have liked to have lived thruogh the 50's and 60's when the wearing of headscarves was all the rage.I first wore a headscarf in my Uni.days to protect my hair going to and from lectures because some of the buildings were spread out on the campus.In those days i used to cross the ends under my chin and tie them off at the back,Grace Kelly style,a style which i used up untill recently,before trying Sarahs way and becoming hooked.I must say it is nice for us ladies to be comlemented on our scarf wearing and it makes it all the more worth while to carry on the trend.What is it about the scarf wearing that you like?
Sarah, sorry i haven't been in the forum for a while,but we are having our Kitchen improved.So what with builders and all the red tape that goes with a listed home i am rather busy at present.I have also to keep within hubbys budget,so there will be no new Hermes scarves for a while.How will i survive!!! Tomorrow i am going for the last fitting of my new skirt.Will let you know when i wear it for the first time. In the mean time happy scarf wearing.
Sarah-Jane
scarf discussion
by
sarah
Posted
: 2005-09-28 10:37
Looking forward to more exploits Sarah Jane. By the way, kitchen improvements are referred to in our house as doing the washing up occasionally! Do you think we're starting something with this scarf thing ? I can't believe how near-extinct the look has become, it seems only yesterday (actually nearer 20 years ago!) that everyone with any style in London was doing it, despite the well-discussed handicaps involved. Funny how these things come and go.
scarf discussion
by
James
Posted
: 2005-10-01 12:44
Ah what a wonderful debate! I have been away from the forum for too long. If Sarah or Sarah Jane would like to see some purely fashion scarf images there are plenty around (I'll search out some of the Yahoo Groups presently). In the meantime try
http://www.flickr.com/photos/23239181@N00/
for example.
Keep up the good work, and look forward to seeing your own pics sometime?
James
scarf discussion
by
Claire
Posted
: 2005-10-01 15:33
Hi to Sarah and Sarah-Jane,
My name is Claire and have enjoyed reading your posts.I wear scarves also,the Kelly style,but tie the knot at the side and not at the back of the neck.Again slightly unusual.If it were ok with you both i would like to chat with you.
Regards Claire
scarf discussion
by
sarah
Posted
: 2005-10-02 12:01
Thanks James, nice to hear from you again. Of course, especially as most of the photos you have found are posed by models who may never have worn a Hermes scarf before, the results are a little off-target, but one ,number 151 I believe, is almost perfect, except she's obviously worried about her lipstick and wearing her knot a bit too low. Many women used to wear their knots much higher than that. The Farrah Fawcett fringe puts it at 1970's I believe? A better hair-style for a Hermes scarf wearer is the "scraped back" look with sunglasses. Keep looking-it's the first picture I've ever seen on the internet that even begins to show the classic Hermes style I love. Wonderful!
scarf discussion
by
Sarah-Jane
Posted
: 2005-10-02 15:03
Hi Sarah,
In answer to your question i think we have started something with this scarf thing. We have two male admirers,James and Razzle and now another scarf wearing lady.
Thank you to to James for the link and welcome to Claire i wouldn't mind in the least chatting about scarves in the forum with you.
Sarah-Jane.
scarf discussion
by
sarah
Posted
: 2005-10-03 17:37
Hello Claire, have you tried the scarf style Sarah-Jane has been trying, or doesn't it appeal to you? If you look at James' photos (see above for the link) the lady in photo number 151 is very close indeed to getting the look right, although it is more sensual if the scarf is almost touching the lips (unless you're getting lipstick on it of course, in which case it's very annoying and extremely costly at the dry cleaners!) The scarf absolutely must be a rolled-edge 36" silk twill square, Hermes for preference as they are the most generous in size and stay in place better, and the weight and drape of the silk is superior in every way.
scarf discussion
by
sarah
Posted
: 2005-10-05 06:13
Just a quickie to the fans of my favourite scarf style (see above). I've just spent hours sifting through various scarf pages, links, galleries etc. and I can honestly say that photo number 151 that James found appears to be the only representation which comes close to being right. I think if anyone knows how to access archive street photos from the 1970's of fashionable London areas (Knightsbridge, Chelsea, etc.) or perhaps social occasions where young aristocrats gathered for outdoor pursuits (showjumping or polo for instance) there may be more shots showing the style, but this would have been pre-internet, so they may not be around. Ho-hum, we'll have to wait for Sarah-Jane's new computer after all!
scarf discussion
by
Claire
Posted
: 2005-10-05 16:16
Hello Sarah,
Firstly i shall introduce myself.I am a young lady in my early twenties,who is very interested in fashion from the 50's and 60's. I have got my interest in scarves from books,magazines and films.
Being young i feel some what stuck out on a limb wearing a headscarf.People asume you are wearing a scarf for religious reasons,but in my case it is for fashion purposes and trying to recreate and keep alive a lost look.My friends have taken some covincing and have made a lot of comments but can now see the advantages of a scarf especially on a windy or rainy day,when i have tied a scarf Kelly style to keep the elements at bay.
I use the kelly style because it gives a good tight,snug fit and needs little adjustment.I haven't tried or seen the style you describe so clearly in your posts,but was interested in the picture shown in the link.The scarf seems to look so graceful on the models head and the the tail just seems to cascade down the back.At the moment my scarf collection is a bit thin on the ground,so i will have to experiment with the scarves i have got.A Hermes would be nice one day,but i do have scarves by channel and Elegance. These would be the scarves i would try to wear your way.It has been nice to share some scarf thoughts with another like minded person.
Regards Claire.
scarf discussion
by
sarah
Posted
: 2005-10-06 05:04
Claire, I'm sure your scarves are wonderful, and it may still be worth trying our "new" way to wear them even if they're not Hermes. The look actually works really well with Liberty of London 36" silk twill squares which cost far less than Hermes. There are also some Italian scarves that come very near to capturing the look. That said, it is possible to pick up an unworn, boxed second-hand Hermes for as little as £50 (they're over £180 new as you probably know!) if you search hard enough. I did just that myself recently. That lady in the photo James indicated above is definitely experiencing the full-on sensual overload of real Hermes, though ,because she can't help smiling- and you're right about how luxurious and elegant it looks, even though her knot, or rather wrapover, could be positioned higher without the dreaded lipstick! By the way, perhaps one should ask- do you enjoy wearing stride-restricting skirts too?
Re: Scarf Discussion
by
James
Posted
: 2005-10-09 18:04
I think that Sarah and Sarah-Jane should volunteer to give Claire some headscarf-tying coaching...and invite us all along for the fun!
James
Re: Scarf Discussion
by
Alan Stansfield
Posted
: 2005-10-16 10:00
I've just stumbled upon the scarf discussion topic and I'm delighted to have found such an enlightened debate. I'm also encouraged to learn there are still ladies who stick to their time honoured principles and defiantly wear Hermes headscarves worn touching the lips - even if it does result in muffled conversation and the accidental gag! Let me say I too love this look, and it's a great pity that more women do not realise how alluring they look when so scarved in this way, even with the very minor inconveniences they incur - the 90cm Hermes profusely adorned with equine symbols in all those glorious colours on that lustrous silk is perfect for this application, as Sarah discovered long ago. My wife has an extensive Hermes collection but has not worn one as a headscarf for at least twenty odd years -sad but true! Actually, I tell a lie - she did wear one two years ago when we were stood in the freezing cold in Trafalgar Square waiting for the Christmas tree lighting service to begin. The headscarf was worn more for comfort than style as I remember, more's the pity!
I should declare an interest in Hermes scarves as I'm a Co-Owner & Moderator of the Yahoo group Hermes Scarf Collectors International. Most of the members are very keen collectors and are very knowledgeable of the history of the HS (Hermes Scarf) but, sadly, no one appears to be an admirer of the Her